TfL could cut buses to Bluewater shopping centre and Darent Valley hospital
TfL are looking at stopping bus routes running beyond Dartford according to a recently uploaded document from Dartford Council.
Transport for London currently operate route 96 from Woolwich to Bluewater via Darent Valley. Bus route 428 runs from Erith while the 492 operates between Sidcup and Bluewater though doesn’t call at Darent Valley hospital.
According to minutes taken from a recent Dartford Council transport meeting Shane Hymers, Kent County Council’s Fastrack Development Manager stated there were “discussions with TfL on their plans to terminate buses at Dartford and not continue to DVH and Bluewater”.
The report notes that “The Principal Transport Planner advised that Dartford Borough Council had indicated that it opposed the curtailing of TfL bus services to DVH and Bluewater and that TfL should also be engaging with the Council on this matter too.
“He felt that more information from TfL was needed so that the Council take this matter up further and be involved in future discussions.”
While no decision has yet been made it was stated that Fastrack and local bus company Go Coaches could help plug the void: “Shane Hymers added that Fastrack felt it would be able to fill this void if the TfL buses to DVH and Bluewater were withdrawn.”
Bus troubles
Transport for London have previously attempted to stop buses on routes 428 and 492 running beyond Dartford but scrapped the idea back in 2020.
Back then TfL stated: “Having considered all of the issues raised by respondents to the consultation, we have decided not to proceed with the withdrawal of the 428 between Bluewater and Crayford and not to proceed with the withdrawal of the 492 between Bluewater and Dartford at this time.
“We will keep both operations under review.”
Since then the London bus network has continued to struggle and last month’s TfL finance report showed bus passenger numbers continue to fall hitting the organisation’s finances.
New homes, fewer buses
The news follows a succession of cuts to buses in south east London over the past year. Oddly these are often in areas serving large new developments which could enable ridership and revenue growth, such as routes serving more than 5,000 new homes built or planned in Kidbrooke linking the town to the Elizabeth line.
TfL cut the 178 just as Greenwich Council’s new housing development was completing alongside TfL’s own development at Kidbrooke Square. Berkeley Homes’ Kidbrooke Village also continues in the area.
Perhaps the starkest example seen recently of cutting buses just as new homes complete is axing the 472 between Abbey Wood and North Greenwich station which served numerous sites of new housing and replaced with the SL11 which skips thousands of new homes at sites ranging from south Thamesmead to Plumstead, Charlton and Greenwich peninsula.
As part of that move TfL implemented an extremely frequent service level on the SL11 but given the route skips so many new homes buses are often running empty as they sails past busy crowds, causing parallel routers such as the 177 to suffer overcrowding and slow down that route.
It was claimed the move was to assist Thamesmead regeneration though the SL11 skips the only Thamesmead regeneration schemes currently underway, as changes in north Thamesmead are many years off commencing. By the time it does, the SL11 route would need retendering.
Hospital site
As for any bus cuts to Bluewater and Darent Valley expect a lot of controversy. The hospital is well used by many in south east London. Traffic in the area is already bad and access by road liable to delays. It’s one of those 1990s-built PFI hospitals heavily reliant on cars.
The same meeting discussing TfL buses also mentioned issues with the hospital car park. There’s plans to change them, but the PFI contract adds to the complexity of taking action.
TfL will no doubt argue why should they be paying to serve those who live outside of London in financially difficult times. Of course the flipside is those buses are well used by Londoners. Bluewater and the many shops within are a large employer. It could be a move to gain additional funding from Kent County Council.
Regardless, they’ll be a lot of noise about this should it proceed.
Finally, just to thank the person who messaged me highlighting the issue having spotted the minutes from Dartford council’s Joint Transportation Board.
What is the matter with TFL and Dartford Council. Routes 96 428 and 492 are popular routes to Bluewater. How are residents from the London Borough of Bexley including areas like Erith and Crayford supposed to get to Darent Valley Hospital.
Sadiq Khan Labour Mayor of London and TFL certainly have a thing about cutting bus services to Hospitals with routes178 291 386 and 486 serving Queen Elizabeth Hospital and route 229 and 286 serving Queen Mary’s Hospital seeing cuts.to frequencies.
We urgently need change at City Hall and in our Town Halls. It is clear that our bus services are not safe in their hands. Especially when it comes to bus services serving Hospitals..
Cutting the service from Erith and Crayford to Darent Valley Hospital will impact Londoners and I’d be interested to see their EqIA of how these impacts would fall.
One way Dartford Borough Council or Kent County Council could make it easier for routes 96 and 428 to serve Bluewater at zero cost would be to let these TfL buses use the Fast Track bus street between the hospital and Bluewater bus station, rather than making them go the long way around and queue up with the cars.
The 96 already uses the Fast track route from and to Bluewater!
Correction: It only uses it between Bluewater and Darrent Valley Hospital!!!
So TFL and the Labour Mayor of London want to cut more bus services serving Hospitals and now he does not want to stop there and cut bus setvices to busy Retail Complexes (Bluewater) .
TFL are he’ll bent on cutting bus services serving Hospitals. Routes serving Queen Elizabeth Hospital 178 291 386 486 hace seen cuts. Queen Mary’s Hospital have seen frequencies to routes 229 and 286 cut.
Kings College Hospital has seen the frequency on route 484 cut witb more routes due to see frequencies cut. Now he wants to stop routes 96 and 428 from setving Darent Valley Hospital as well as Bluewater.
It is clear our bus services are not safe in TFL and Labour controlled Local Authorities hands. As local councillors and MP”s also agree these cuts to bus services..
Tell us with evidence which party would safeguard bus services, i.e. not one whose policy is to cut public services.
Good question John C
At this rate, playing the ‘blame game’ cannot resolve this issue. Let’s raise a petition against this insensitivity that could potentially make the journey to DVH and Blue Water more difficult for many, especially the vulnerable people.
Could TfL, Dartford Council and Kent Council Council run a new direct bus service from Woolwich to Bluewaters via Dartford. And to use the existing route without having to use the A2.
Yet again it shows the Labour Mayor of Lonfon/TFL Simply do not care about people that need to use these bus routes to get to hospital appointments and for treatments including cancer and treatments of other long term health conditions. Many of whom are elderly and disabled.. Who rely heavily on these bus routes.
So a clear Message to the Mayor of London and TFL is stop cutting bus services and bus service frequencies on routes serving Hospitals.
Routes 96 428 and 492 are well used routes to and from Bluewater so should not be withdrawn between Dartford and Bluewater.
Kent voted for this.
Buses linking Woolwich and Bluewater are being reviewed by Transport for London after the Reform-run Kent County Council hiked charges to use an access road to reach the shopping centre.
The Reform administration, which was elected last year, also plans to increase the cost of school travel passes in the county by 26 per cent.
Exactly this. Dartford and Bexley areas vote extreme gammon and Sadiq doesn’t need to spend money in those areas as they are hopeless. If the majority of people in Dartford wanted better for themselves and their families they would vote for it.
We do not know the state of the finances left by the previous administration when Reform took ovet the council.
That said school transport is expensive to operate even the current Government are looking into the cost of SEND transport as part of the larger SEND review..
TFL, Dartford Council and Kent County Council could fund a rapid bus transit system (BRT) between, Woolwich Thamesmead or Bexleyheath to maintain a a vital bus link to Darent Valley Hospital and Bluewater.on a daily basis.
They’re not just contemplating it TFL have already done it- attempted to get 96 to Bluewater today only to be booted off at Darent Valley & services showing as going to Bluewater turning up yet again terminating at the hospital.
Baffled as to where they think the commuters/shoppers/patients will go?
The congestion issue will still continue to exist even if services terminate at Darent Valley or Dartford so I don’t see how cutting the final stop (and a major one at that) solves that problem?
Absolutely Zoe and well said. Exactly Where do they expect patients, commuters and shoppers to go.
I know many people who use the 96 from the Bluewater area who travel to Woolwich for work etc as it is cheaper for them. Likewise with people travelling to Bluewater much cheaper than the train.
Cutting routes 96 428 and 492 back to Dartford will achieve nothing in terms of cutting congestion etc. It will just make it harder for passengers who use these routes.. Route 492 Bluewater to Sidcup Station needs a frequency increase every 30 minutes is far to infrequent for a london bus services to a busy shopping complex.
To me tbis proves Labour do not care about the patients staff and visitors needing to travel to Hospitals. It is the Labour Mayor For London backed by Councillors and local.MP”s who also back these plans to cut bus services. I signed a petition to stop the curs to route 286 serving Queen Mary’s Hospital which was created by Local Conservatives Councillors..I cannot see Labour Councillors doing the same and going against their own Labour Mayor For London. Politicians should keep their hands off our bus services when it comes to routes timetables etc. They only make a mess of it.
Good question John C